Daniel Greenfield: The Civil War is Here

found online by Raymond

From T. Paine at Saving Common Sense:

A reader and friend of Saving Common Sense directed me to this excellent article on FrontPage Mag that was written by Daniel Greenfield yesterday. The article is entitled, “THE CIVIL WAR IS HERE: The left doesn’t want to secede. It wants to rule.”

As I told my friend, this is perhaps one of the best articles I have read in awhile. I was contemplating some of the same ideas espoused in the article and was working on a very rough draft over the last few weeks when time permitted, but Mr. Greenfield did such a masterful job of articulating the issues at hand, that it seemed pointless for me to reinvent the wheel.

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9 thoughts on “Daniel Greenfield: The Civil War is Here”

  1. Not surprisingly, I have an alternative viewpoint on Mr. Greenfield’s attack on dissent from his one party rule.

    It’s no wonder Mr. Paine finds reassurance in Greenfield’s diatribe. He reinforces all the stereotypes, smears, and propaganda against liberals that the Right gobbles up like kids in a candy shop.

    Cons, and especially the most authoritarian inclined among them, are convinced liberals are wrong about, and to be blamed for, everything. This belief system based on lies and ignorance fuels their hate to wild extremes. People have been murdered simply for being seen as liberals.

    Any lie, any accusation, any insult, any slur, any attack, and any demeaning words for any liberal for any false reason is gospel to the true believers of the authoritarian far Right. Demonization is their tactic. Hate and ignorance are their guiding forces.

    And the projection from Breitbart darling, and loyal Trumpist, Horowitz’s hate site is unbelievable.


    For the Left, it’s national suicide, or else.

    He could start by denouncing the SPLC.

    Trump isn’t up against “sore losers.” He’s facing an army of saboteurs bent on destroying the elected government.

    David Horowitz proclaims: Steve Bannon, Civil Rights Hero…Stephen Miller is President Trump’s senior advisor for policy and has been my friend since he was a student at Santa Monica High School in 2001.

    Horowitz may pontificate on the Constitution, but IOKYOAR to ignore it. Like his buddy Trump Adviser Stephen Miller, “The powers of the president to protect our country are very substantial and will not be questioned.”

    “Obey our authority without question!”, is the clear message of a fascist and con-servative authoritarian

    “The left doesn’t want to secede. It wants to rule.”

    Greenfield’s projection is as dense as mud in a swamp.

    Just a few example from Greenfield’s article:

    Political conflicts become civil wars when one side refuses to accept the existing authority. The left has rejected all forms of authority that it doesn’t control. (As in Obama had no authority to appoint Garland? As in the EPA regulating polluters? As in regulating Wall Street?)

    The left has rejected the outcome of the last two presidential elections won by Republicans. (NOT won by popular mandate, of course. It was the Right that said “Hell NO!” to Obama, elected by a majority both times, from day one. So much for listening to the people.)

    It rejected the Constitution so long ago that it hardly bears mentioning. (Elimination of constitutional taxation, constitutional provision for the general welfare, and constitutional regulation of commerce, while suppressing voter registration and access to polls, has always been the Right’s agenda.)

    It was for Obama defying the orders of Federal judges… (As in “so-called Judges”, or judges unqualified because of their parents birthplace?)

    It was for Obama penalizing whistleblowers, but now undermining the government from within has become “patriotic”. (Bullshit.)

    Each defeat led the radicalized Democrats to relocate from more democratic to less democratic institutions. Radicalized? Less Democratic? Even when they win with FEWER votes by an un-democratic electoral college, and gerrymandering, cons are crybabies?)

    A common country based around certain civilizational values. (As if Trump’s birtherism, racism, sexism, lack of basic decency, demolition of democracy, scorn for the judiciary, ignorance, bigotry, and arrogance are not a radical abandonment of “civilizational values”?)

    That’s why compromise has become impossible. Our system of government was designed to allow different groups to negotiate their differences. (See “HELL NO!”)

    …disregarding the interests and values of most of the country. (Again, MOST Americans voted AGAINST Trump!!!!!)

    Here’s the bottom line. There can be no reasoning with authoritarians. They lie, smear, demonize, and resort to every dirty trick and dishonest tactic in the pursuit of power by the economic elites over the people, over democratic institutions, over the government, and over our Constitution.

    Authoritarians’ enemies are liberals, journalists, educators, public servants, scientists, and everyone else dedicated to truth and service to fellow humans.

    We all must serve the almighty dollar, revere wealth, and serve the interests of the rich and powerful. If you dare dissent, your will be targeted and demonized with lies and false accusations.

    That is who they are. We have put fascists in the White House.

    God help us.

  2. Let’s see, you quote Horowitz in response to article by Greenfield. That’s “odd”.

    “Political conflicts become civil wars when one side refuses to accept the existing authority.”
    Are you over looking antifi riots? Are you ignoring calls to resist by liberals? (See “HELL NO!”)

    “The left has rejected the outcome of the last two presidential elections won by Republicans”.
    Hint, it’s not the popular vote that determines the winner.

    “gerrymandering”, tell us how that works in a Senatorial or Governors election?
    Democratic that’s rule by elected officials not a republic, check into that before you whine even more about how unfair it is that in the last 8 years the democrat party has gotten a butt beating.

    “There can be no reasoning with authoritarians.” That’s why the policy’s of liberals have to be mandated, cause the people want them sooo much… there would be no other way to enact them.. Example, Obamacare you HAVE to buy health insurance or you will penalize.

    The rest of your rebuttal only supports Greenfield’s essay more. Keep up the good work!

  3. I have to agree with Majormajor. Mr. Dubya’s rant perfectly illustrates Mr. Greenfield’s assertion.

    Indeed, it is because of many of these exact behaviors of the more militant Left that Mr. Greenfield described that was seemingly embraced by Mr. Dubya on his own blog that caused me to no longer frequent it anymore.

    It became a place where there was never any room for serious debate or discussion there anymore. It was only a place for demagoguing, demonization, and Alinsky-style tactics to be used against anyone that had the temerity to offer an opposing viewpoint from that of the host. Such is his prerogative to run his site as he so chooses, but it is also mine to no longer partake in discussions on such a site when the level of debate becomes sophomoric in the extreme.

    There is no room for civil discourse with many folks on the Left anymore. If one is pro-life, then he is obviously a misogynistic patriarchal sexist. If one supports traditional marriage, he is obviously a homophobe who would remove gay folks from society if given the chance. If one is for enforcing EXISTING immigration law, then he must obviously be a racist and bigot. These are the extremes of the new Left mantra. Submit to our brand of “democratic authoritarianism” or we will shout you down, marginalize you, intimidate you, and even riot against you. Mr. Greenfield was dead on accurate.

    So much for “love trumping hate.”

  4. It is amusing that Major wants us to focus on the horrors of Obamacare, when it, and Obama, are now far more popular than Trump.

    I’m quite impressed by Mr. Paine’s ability to support Major’s position without offering any facts.

    I’m also impressed by the scope of Mr. Paine’s evidence-free accusation. (If I had a dollar for every time…)

    “demagoguing, demonization, and Alinsky-style tactics to be used against anyone that had the temerity to offer an opposing viewpoint from that of the host. ”

    One may easily investigate the discussions at my blog to seek any evidence that supports Mr. Paine’s accusations. If one were to waste enough time with such an endeavor, a pattern would emerge.

    Opposing viewpoints are always welcome. Lots of them are all over the place. When viewpoints contained projections, accusations and falsehoods they were corrected as needed.

    Apparently the final straw for Mssrs. Paine and Major was my insistence that a demonizing falsehood be acknowledged as untrue. The lie was something about Democrats sitting “stone-faced” and refusing to applaud or recognize the widow at Trump’s speech before Congress. (The widow’s loss was blamed on “the generals”, but this buck-passing didn’t seem to bother our conservative friends.)

    Their outrage was towards me, of course. How could I have been so “disgusting”?

    I wonder if I was unconsciously using some “Alinsky-style tactic” by noting the facts.

    Darn it all. No wonder they’re infuriated.

  5. I had started out my original response by pulling six pages of quotations from Mr. Dubya from his blog that perfectly illustrate my point regarding his intolerance that Mr. Greenfield described some on the Left as having with their “you’re with us or you are the enemy” mentality. I then decided that it was pointless to provide all of these quotations. People may go to his blog and see for themselves if they so choose. A pattern does indeed emerge; on that, Mr. Dubya is correct.

    I have been called a racist, an authoritarian, a Trumpist (even though I often denounce him and did not vote for him), and lumped in with “con-servatives” that have no human decency, worship corporations and money, and want to destroy the environment and harm the poor. I continued to post foolishly on Mr. Dubya’s blog despite all of this because every once in a long while we would have a point of agreement. What I neglected to fully see is those agreements only occurred when I happened to agree with one of his positions and never the other way around.

    What ended it for me was not something Michael Moore or the Democrats did or said about the grieving widow of a SEAL killed in a mission. It is interesting that Dave thinks that is the reason.

    What did it for me was when Mr. Dubya and another commenter then started questioning the soul and salvation of Majormajor for telling a “lie” on the site. When one resorts to that sort of condemnation, then there is really little more for me to debate with them.

    I am the first to admit that I am not always right and that I am definitely an imperfect sinner so I do not ever intend to come of as so self righteous; however, Mr. Dubya will sometimes quote scripture to make a point, but evidently doesn’t want to remove the beam from his own eye before removing the speck from his brother’s.

    I think Dave Dubya means well and in his heart is a good guy with the best of intentions. That said, he has been caught up in an agenda that insists on full compliance with it and complete “resistance and persistence”to their ideology over that of conservatism or Republicans. I wish the best for him regardless.

  6. TP,

    Thank you for your understanding of my basic decency. The sentiment is mutual.

    I’m sorry you are under the impression of being called Trumpist, racist, etc. You are neither.

    I was making an effort to point out certain beliefs and accusations from you as Trumpist in nature. If I noted your use of terms like “Democrat plantation” were also used by Klansmen and racists, that is not saying you are a Klansman or racist. I’m also certain I made note of where you were not Trumpist.

    And why do you pretend you are the victim? I’ve been on the receiving end of many of your false accusations. Double Ditto from Major. I’ve been told liberals are commies, and charged with “demagoguing, demonization, and Alinsky-style tactics” without given the courtesy of evidence. Liberals have been accused of causing every bad thing imaginable, of being the lowest in character, yet you get upset when a mirror is held to reflect this treatment back at the far Right.

    You share the same false beliefs and antagonism towards liberals as Greenfield. I illustrated the falsehoods and projections with examples. Then you get offended and leveled un-sourced personal accusations when that view is challenged. THAT is very authoritarian behavior. Not that I am calling you an authoritarian. But maybe you are… I wouldn’t rule out the possibility.

    I am anti-authoritarian by nature. Feel free to label that any way you choose.

    We can get carried away sometimes, but come on.

    I also understand that my correcting your falsehoods could be seen as unwelcome or as accusations.

    You have a tendency to repeat the same falsehoods and accusations I corrected in the past. “Founder of Greenpeace”, “Al Gore invented human influenced climate change”, etc. This creates the impression that you ignore, or disrespect, my words and seek only what you can use to frame my words in a negative light.

    Case in point:

    ”agreements only occurred when I happened to agree with one of his positions and never the other way around.”

    I recall numerous times I agreed with the Pope and you did not. Also you forget I am an outdoor sports enthusiast. I have firearms and support the Second Amendment. Perhaps you believe this can’t be possible since I don’t agree everyone should be armed and able to buy rocket launchers.

    I have to wonder though, why my response to an obvious lie from Major elicited your condemnation for me, and support for him.

    And why does that lie need to be referred to as a “lie”?

    It is either true or it is not. If you reject the truth, refuse to disavow the lie, and support the liar, then you are being Trumpist in that regard. Not voting for him was commendable, but emulating him is not.

    Don’t take it personally. Just ask yourself why you would choose to do such a thing.

  7. What does your basic decency have to say about Susan Rice, Evelyn Farkas?

    I take this as directed for me to answer.

    Basic decency says they are targets of lies from the radical Right and dishonest Trumpists.

    You know, sort of like “And when President Trump honored the widow of a fallen American SEAL the Democrats sat stone-faced and silent.”

    Remember when you dumped that demonizing lie? Just after I called you out on this, and noted your blatant lies were hypocrisy, because you pose as a “Christian”, TP decided he had enough and left in a huff..Maybe defending you is exhausting. In that case, it certainly requires compromising one’s basic decency.

    As I recall, Jesus called out hypocrites and liars. I was “over the top” for doing that same thing.

    Love trumps hate, it calls out lies, and defends the targets of lies.

    Jesus knows this. He sees into the black hearts of con-servatism, just like He saw into the self-righteous Pharisees, the con-servatives of His time.

    All evidence indicates truth is the enemy of the Republican Party and Trump. This is why they demonize and seek to suppress our free press, educators, journalists, and scientists to dupe Americans into giving them one-party rule.

    This is also why basic decency is out of the question in pursuing their vile purposes. Basic decency has no place in poisoning our environment, spewing more greenhouse gases, fueling bigotry, taking from the poor, enriching the wealthy, taking away health care, breaking up families, and obstructing minority voter rights.

    But, hey. At least con-servatives stand for something.

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